The Truth about ANWR!

[pjc]

THE TRUTH ABOUT ANWR

Next time you pay $4.59/gal for gas, thank a liberal environmentalist.
In addition to ANWR, we should be drilling off shore, like the Chinese and Cubans are
planning to do 60 miles off the Florida coast; and we should be taking the Rocky Mt. shale oil like Canada is doing.

FIRST, do you know what ANWR is?

ANWR = Arctic National Wildlife Refuge.

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Now, a size comparison
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image001.jpg

And some perspective..
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image002.jpg
NOTE WHERE THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT AREA IS..

(it's in the "ANWR Coastal Plain")
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image003.jpg


THIS IS WHAT THE DEMOCRATS, LIBERALS AND "GREENS" (ECO-GESTAPO)
SHOW YOU WHEN THEY TALK ABOUT ANWR
...and they are right..these ARE photographs of ANWR
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image004.jpg

http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image005.jpg

http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image006.jpg

ISN'T ANWR BEAUTIFUL?
WHY SHOULD WE DRILL HERE (AND DESTROY) THIS BEAUTIFUL PLACE?

-

-

WELL..THAT'S NOT EXACTLY THE TRUTH

Do you remember the map?

The map showed that the proposed drilling area is in the ANWR Coastal Plain

Do those photographs look like a coastal plain to you?

WHAT'S GOING ON HERE?

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THE ANSWER IS SIMPLE...

THAT IS NOT WHERE THEY WANT TO DRILL!

THIS IS WHAT THE PROPOSED EXPLORATION AREA
ACTUALLY LOOKS LIKE IN THE WINTER
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image007.jpg

AND THIS IS WHAT IT ACTUALLY LOOKS LIKE IN THE SUMMER
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image008.jpg

http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image009.jpg

http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image010.jpg

HERE ARE A COUPLE SCREEN SHOTS FROM GOOGLE EARTH
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image011.jpg

http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image012.jpg

AS YOU CAN SEE, THE AREA WHERE THEY ARE
TALKING ABOUT DRILLING IS A BARREN WASTELAND.

OH..AND THEY SAY THAT THEY ARE CONCERNED ABOUT
THE EFFECT ON THE LOCAL WILDLIF..

HERE IS A PHOTO (SHOT DURING THE SUMMER) OF THE
"DEPLETED WILDLIFE" SITUATION CREATED BY DRILLING AROUND
PRUDHOE BAY*..
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image013.jpg

DO YOU THINK THAT THE CARIBOU ARE REALLY BOTHERED BY THE DRILLING

HERE'S THAT SAME SPOT DURING THE WINTER.
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image014.jpg

HEY, THIS BEAR SEEMS TO REALLY HATE
THE PIPELINE NEAR PRUDHOE BAY"...
http://www.baja.net/ANWR/image015.jpg

*The Prudhoe Bay area accounts for 17% of U.S. domestic oil production.

NOW, WHY DO YOU THINK THAT THE DEMOCRATS ARE LYING ABOUT ANWR?

REMEMBER WHEN AL GORE SAID THAT THE GOVERNMENT
SHOULD WORK TO ARTIFICIALLY RAISE GAS PRICES
TO $5.00 A GALLON?

WELL...

AL GORE AND HIS FELLOW DEMOCRATS
HAVE ALMOST REACHED THEIR GOAL!

NOW THAT YOU KNOW THAT THE DEMOCRATS HAVE BEEN LYING,
WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT?

YOU CAN START BY COPYING OR LINKING TO THIS PAGE
AND FORWARDING THIS URL TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW..!
SO THAT THEY WILL KNOW THE TRUTH.

[TreyP]

What truth? That of the oil companies? That of the "suck the planet dry of resources" lunitics? That of the "give it to me so I can get it all now" idiots? That of the "rape everything so I can have my cheap resources to feed my 10 kids"

Amazing that some people just look out for themselves instead of the survival of the human race.

Guess what? ANWAR wouldn't do squat to the global energy problem, yet idoits like pjc see it as a end all to the worlds problems. Fools follow fools.

[Vtr_Racing]

Wow, I though I heard Trey on Xbox live the other night with an English accent. Sheesh dude.
Guess what? ANWAR wouldn't do squat to the global energy problem, yet idoits like pjc see it as a end all to the worlds problems. Fools follow fools.


What would be your answer to address the worlds problem? Specifically the gas issue.

[pjc]

What truth? That of the oil companies? That of the "suck the planet dry of resources" lunitics? That of the "give it to me so I can get it all now" idiots? That of the "rape everything so I can have my cheap resources to feed my 10 kids"

Amazing that some people just look out for themselves instead of the survival of the human race.

Guess what? ANWAR wouldn't do squat to the global energy problem, yet idoits like pjc see it as a end all to the worlds problems. Fools follow fools.

And there is Trey riding his dirtbike avatar >>That runs on GASOLINE<< with another intelligent rebuttal (/sarcasm).

Dude, you are a Bat Shiat Crazy!

I suppose we should leave the oil in the ground? Do tell us why Trey. This will be incredibly entertaining.

[TreyP]

And there is Trey riding his dirtbike avatar >>That runs on GASOLINE<< with another intelligent rebuttal (/sarcasm).

Dude, you are a Bat Shiat Crazy!

I suppose we should leave the oil in the ground? Do tell us why Trey. This will be incredibly entertaining.

Nice to see that you are drunk again old man. How much oil are we going to extract from ANWAR? Why is it so important to the oil companies to drill there? As posted elseware there are plenty of places that would be of better economic value then ANWAR.

What's entertaining is your tactics that mirror the same stupidity as the enviromental radicals that you so hate.

[pjc]

Trey, answer my question first and then I'll answer yours.

Mine is "Should we leave the energy resources in the ground?" posted after you said "That of the "suck the planet dry of resources" lunitics [sic]? That of the "give it to me so I can get it all now" idiots? That of the "rape everything so I can have my cheap resources to feed my 10 kids" comment.

Stay focused now..

[Matt_Stankavich]

What truth? That of the oil companies? That of the "suck the planet dry of resources" lunitics? That of the "give it to me so I can get it all now" idiots? That of the "rape everything so I can have my cheap resources to feed my 10 kids"

Amazing that some people just look out for themselves instead of the survival of the human race.

Guess what? ANWAR wouldn't do squat to the global energy problem, yet idoits like pjc see it as a end all to the worlds problems. Fools follow fools.

I have bit my toungue for awhile on this subject anytime it poped up but I am curious. Why does it matter, and how many reindeer does it affect if we drill there, find our lil Saudi Arabia of oil and not have to depend on foriegn nations for survival. Are you afraid we are going to cave in the planet if we take what is rightfully ours out? Its been awhile since I was in school, but from what I remember isn't oil and natural resources the soul reason we bought that barron icey wasteland? I was always under the impression to use any and all "resources" for your survival. But hey, if you want to vote left and not drill, continue to pay out the ass for oil, and then be taxed to death so we can support all the hanger ons, then thats your deal.

Fools follow fools, but ignorance is bliss!!

[TreyP]

Trey, answer my question first and then I'll answer yours.

Mine is "Should we leave the energy resources in the ground?" posted after you said "That of the "suck the planet dry of resources" lunitics [sic]? That of the "give it to me so I can get it all now" idiots? That of the "rape everything so I can have my cheap resources to feed my 10 kids" comment.

Stay focused now..

Now stay focused..

Why should we drill in a place that is of limited resources when other places show bigger payouts? What is the fascination with ANWAR?

[pjc]

Now stay focused..

Why should we drill in a place that is of limited resources when other places show bigger payouts? What is the fascination with ANWAR?

Trey, look at the maps. The drilling site is very, very near Prudhoe Bay and the the northern end of trans-Alaskan pipeline. HINT: It's easy to get to, and easy to transport out.

And it's not just ANWR. The far DemonRats have killed energy leases and exploration on a widescale. Creating the Escelante NM under the Klinton admin locked up absolutely huge amounts of high quality coal and natural gas..

[TreyP]

Trey, look at the maps. The drilling site is very, very near Prudhoe Bay and the the northern end of trans-Alaskan pipeline. HINT: It's easy to get to, and easy to transport out.

And it's not just ANWR. The far DemonRats have killed energy leases and exploration on a widescale. Creating the Escelante NM under the Klinton admin locked up absolutely huge amounts of high quality coal and natural gas..

The simple fact is you blame everything on the dems and don't look at the whole picture like the rest of the political parties. You are no better the the envior -nazis and thier tactics. That you don't see that is why you are a joke.

[pjc]

The simple fact is you blame everything on the dems and don't look at the whole picture like the rest of the political parties. You are no better the the envior -nazis and thier tactics. That you don't see that is why you are a joke.

Insults again? Come-on man. Is this how you conduct yourself throughout life, shouting slobbering degradation like a petulant child whenever you make a mistake?

Back to the subject at hand, i.e. ANWR.

Now Trey, brace yourself. I know you do not like facts.

FACT = Only and unfortunately one Republican voted to not drill in ANWR. One. Do the math. It's elementary.

[TreyP]

Insults again? Come-on man. Is this how you conduct yourself throughout life, shouting slobbering degradation like a petulant child whenever you make a mistake?

Back to the subject at hand, i.e. ANWR.

Now Trey, brace yourself. I know you do not like facts.

FACT = Only and unfortunately one Republican voted to not drill in ANWR. One. Do the math. It's elementary.

Your point? Come on you can do better.

[Ziggy]

Montana has just found a new oil field near Sidney on the North Dakota border.It has an estimated 9 Billion barrels.(I'm sure it was Billion and not million).One of my pals leased his warehouse to a company who got a contract to build 9000 storage tanks.Finally I think we will start taking it out of the ground.
The farmers there sat on the oil for a while because the oil companies would not give them the going rate for the product.Things have changed in the last year and its easier to transport now that there is a pipeline directly to the 3 refineries in Billings.
A millionaire a day is what Fox news says about the land owners.

I am a conspiracy theorist at heart and I hope the NWO and Gore as one of its top members are not bleeding us dry and amassing a fortune to use against us.

[pjc]

Montana has just found a new oil field near Sidney on the North Dakota border.It has an estimated 9 Billion barrels.(I'm sure it was Billion and not million).

Good post Ziggy! I forgot about the ND find.

[pjc]

Your point? Come on you can do better.

My point?

Let me type in BIG LETTERS FOR YOU, like in first grade.

You said "you blame everything on the dems".

I said "Only and unfortunately one Republican voted to not drill in ANWR. One. Do the math. It's elementary."

Do you "get it" now?

[Ziggy]

Brazil had a similiar find right after Christmas with an estimated 8 billion barrels found just off the coast and there was a huge deal made all around the globe.When the find in Montana became apparent I expected major headlines.There has been hardly anything.It makes me wonder what is going on.

[Offspring]

Guess what? ANWAR wouldn't do squat to the global energy problem, yet idoits like pjc see it as a end all to the worlds problems. Fools follow fools.

It sure as hell would help OUR energy problem, and I haven't seen him try to solve the WORLDS problems, why should we?

[randy s]

but if we build refineries then they'll charge more to do that. drilling in no. alaska or anywhere else in the u.s. won't do any good as long as we don't have a way to refine the stuff. and if we do throw refineries up , they'll tack on the cost factor and keep on hosing us. it just is'nt going to help anytime soon. i see it less as a environmental issue than a grab for the oil companies to keep hosing us. and if anyone thinks that we'll stop screwing around with foreign oil suppliers just because we're drilling up there or anywhere else in the lower 48 they need to understand that the oil companies are not your friends and will hose us no matter where they drill. if it actually helped to lower prices at the pump, it might be worthy of discussion. it won't.

[Shotdsherrif]

Brazil had a similiar find right after Christmas with an estimated 8 billion barrels found just off the coast and there was a huge deal made all around the globe.When the find in Montana became apparent I expected major headlines.There has been hardly anything.It makes me wonder what is going on.

If I remember correctly (and I may be wrong which is why I'm asking), the find in Montana involves an experimental new technology for horizontal drilling, its not ready for prime time but can be in a few short years.

That has been one of the issues with a lot of the Canadian Shales fields, right? Based on cost of extraction, they only justify themselves as investments if oil REMAINS above a certain price point. But if oil goes back down to $60+/- when the speculation bubble bursts then its a moot point.

And also, GHW Bush was the one who signed an executive order barring new exploration; I KNOW I'm right about that. And when W threw the issue to congress just last week, Pelosi reminded him that he could just as easily rescind that executive order as browbeat the Dem congress. New exploration could not move forward without BOTH branches signing off on it. So could Bush just maybe be using this as another divisive wedge issue when the facts clearly don't back him up? That's a question there ...

And also, personally I have no sacred feeling toward ANWR myself. As Dennis Miller said, we're saving it for the caribou? REALLY?!?!?!?!? So if its time to open it up ... or open up other exploration, I think the time is ripe for this to become a bipartisan issue ... could happen, I'd support it.

That is unless of course, getting to be condescending toward the 80%+ of people who don't see things EXACTLY as you do is really ALL its about for you ... there ... mr.pat

[randy s]

you know? reindeer and caribou and those other critters up there are pretty smart. if they don't like what's going on , they usually go somewhere else to hang out. if they're going to drill anywhere, i'd rather have them do it way the f--k up there than somewhere around here. no matter where a person stands on issues like these, i don't think exxon or oxy or chevron are going to stop drilling anytime soon. they're far from finished greasing us up and slamming it home i'm afraid.

[pjc]

you know? reindeer and caribou and those other critters up there are pretty smart. if they don't like what's going on , they usually go somewhere else to hang out. if they're going to drill anywhere, i'd rather have them do it way the f--k up there than somewhere around here. no matter where a person stands on issues like these, i don't think exxon or oxy or chevron are going to stop drilling anytime soon. they're far from finished greasing us up and slamming it home i'm afraid.

Randy, assign a percentage value to who you think are the culprits behind the high energy prices today. Here is the list. The total of course must not exceed 100%.

Oil Companies

Government Taxation

Devaluation of the US Dollar

Speculation

Supply and Demand

Environmental Obstructionism


Feel free too add another if you'd like.

[Chase 2]

Randy, assign a percentage value to who you think are the culprits behind the high energy prices today. Here is the list. The total of course must not exceed 100%.

Oil Companiesincluding OPEC 20%

Government Taxation0.1%

Devaluation of the US Dollar10%

Speculation55%

Supply and Demand20%

Environmental Obstructionism0.1%


Feel free too add another if you'd like.

Don't forget to include the "county owned" oil companies in OPEC!!!

[Mot51560]

In the 70's Prudhoe Bay and the pipeline were suppose to be the answer to our problems. Look where were at today ANWR is not the answer.

[randy s]

i'm not sure. but greed was left off your list and that is a factor certainly don't you reckon? record profits and ridiculous pay packages for the executives. making money is the goal of any outfit. but when it has the effect that it's having on folks at home like it is, it's like biting the hand that feeds you. i watched those guys [oil company executives] being semi-grilled on cspan and the answers they were giving and not giving made me want to jump through my tv screen and choke em' out [the politicians and the execs]. and all these weak sister politicians on both sides just laid down for these leeches like nobodys business. it was almost like the politicians were on their payroll. you think?

[Cadwell]

These gas prices have effect my beer prices ....and I am mad and not gonna take it anymore!!! We need to do something to get these beer prices down NOW!!!!!!!

[Chase 2]

IMO it's wrong to blame US based "Big Oil" and shows a lack of understanding of the world oil industry.

Sure Exxon/Mobil may be the biggest but but combined BP, Shell, Total, Agip, and many from other countries are producers along with many "national" oil companies like PEMEX or CITCO make EXXON look like chump change. Record profit is one, thing but look at return on investment and you see another picture. I am in no way a fan of major oil companies, but I see commodities investors as more of a source of the problem we have now.

I've worked Prudhoe Bay, I've been on exploration drilling project in the Brooks Range. I see no reason to drill ANWR.

[Ryno]

These gas prices have effect my beer prices ....and I am mad and not gonna take it anymore!!! We need to do something to get these beer prices down NOW!!!!!!!


You must drink the high fallutin' stuff. I bought an 18 wheeler of Bud Light for 9.99 today. Beer is actually going DOWN. Apparently when the economy goes to crap, people drink more.


Back to ANWR. Show me a figure on the # of barrels up there, then review it. The US needs to become independent of the world for oil. Period. What it costs to do that, is another story. Until China cleans up their act, environmental concerns need not be heard.

[pjc]

Don't forget to include the "county owned" oil companies in OPEC!!!

Good, honest try.. Here are some rogh estimates from simple observation.


Oil Companies 10%

Government Taxation 10%

Devaluation of the US Dollar 30%

Speculation 15%

Supply and Demand 20%

Environmental Obstructionism 15% (Federal laws, etc.)

[pjc]

i'm not sure. but greed was left off your list and that is a factor certainly don't you reckon? record profits and ridiculous pay packages for the executives. making money is the goal of any outfit.


And those >>>primarily<<< rewarded are the shareholders. You know, like the retirement plan you may have.


i watched those guys [oil company executives] being semi-grilled on cspan and the answers they were giving and not giving made me want to jump through my tv screen and choke em' out [the politicians and the execs.


The threats to nationalize the oil companies was nothing but bait for the bitter and uniformed. Our Congress is the most moronic in history. If I was one of those execs I'd tell those commie pinheads to F-off. ON CSPAN!

[Chase 2]

Speculation 15%

If speculation was that low, every time a hurricane went into the Texas Gulf the price of world oil wouldn't rise. Especially with the Saudi's and the Ruski's in control of most of the world's oil production. And, I hate to tell you this but most of the world's oil production is already nationalized.

[pjc]

If speculation was that low, every time a hurricane went into the Texas Gulf the price of world oil wouldn't rise. Especially with the Saudi's and the Ruski's in control of most of the world's oil production. And, I hate to tell you this but most of the world's oil production is already nationalized.

MMM, what is that list of countries with nationalized energy?

Your argument about speculation is valid, I can only add that I see this percentage as a basis over time and not on spot prices in short duration.

[mgobaja]

This seems to be more then 100 % :


Originally Posted by pjc
Randy, assign a percentage value to who you think are the culprits behind the high energy prices today. Here is the list. The total of course must not exceed 100%.

Oil Companiesincluding OPEC 20%

Government Taxation0.1%

Devaluation of the US Dollar10%

Speculation55%

Supply and Demand20%

Environmental Obstructionism0.1%


Feel free too add another if you'd like.

[Ziggy]

Dunb question?
How can Mexico afford to sell gas and diesel for $2 a gallon to the consumer?

[Chase 2]

Dunb question?
How can Mexico afford to sell gas and diesel for $2 a gallon to the consumer?

Pemex is a nationalized oil company, that is, Mexico owns PEMEX. The oil Mexico produces doesn't cost them $140 per barrel to produce. The cost for PEMEX to produce (on average) is more likely in the $20 to $50 per barrel range.

[Chase 2]

MMM, what is that list of countries with nationalized energy?

Adnoc is the state-owned company of the United Arab Emigrates
CNOOC is a 71% state-owned company of China
INOC is the state-owned company of Iraq
KPC is the state-owned company of Kuwait
Libya NOC is the state-owned company of Libya
NIOC is the state-owned company of Iran
NNPC is the state-owned company of Nigeria
ONGC is the 71.4% state-owned company of India
PDVSA is the state-owned company of Venezuela
Pemex is the state-owned company of Mexico
Pertamina is the state-owned company of Indonesia
PetroChina is the 90% state-owned company of China
Petronas is the state-owned company of Malaysia
QP is the state-owned company of Qatar
Rosneft is the 75.16% state-owned company of Russia
Saudi Aramco is the state-owned company of Saudi Arabia
Sonatrach is the state-owned company of Algeria
Statoil is the 70.9% state oil company of Norway


Hmmm... see any of the largest producers on the list???? How about the guys with the largest reserves???

[Shotdsherrif]

Dunb question?
How can Mexico afford to sell gas and diesel for $2 a gallon to the consumer?

My guess is their oil industry is largely nationalized which means the government dictates to oil companies doing business internally, at what price they may sell their product. Not unlike corn/farm subsidies here at home.

Which reminds me of something. ... Hey Pat, Don't mean to interrupt your frothing, Dem-bashing tirade ... but if in trying to cause a stink about ANWR - as a domestic energy solution that Dems are allegedly blocking - aren't you in effect dictating that any new sources of oil found would ONLY then be used for domestic consumption - and as such, curtailing the oil company from maximizing their profit on the open international market and thus calling into serious question your supposed "Free Market" Republican bonafides?

Since you allege earlier in this thread, that supply and demand issues only amount to 20% of the pressure on current prices, then it seems you are suggesting this would then justify a partial nationalization of the oil industry in order to stabilize domestic energy markets.

And if so ... then you're seriously starting to sound like Ted Kennedy on a crack bender and frankly, it's scaring me a little.

Take your time if you want, but I'll remind you ... I've noticed that often, when faced with a measured, sensible response to one of your typical rants, instead of taking the opportunity to engage in an actual discussion, you've instead just flat out ignored the post and gone after the low-hanging fruit of liberal-bashing. I'll say no more.

[pjc]

Which reminds me of something. ... Hey Pat, Don't mean to interrupt your frothing, Dem-bashing tirade ... but if in trying to cause a stink about ANWR - as a domestic energy solution that Dems are allegedly blocking - aren't you in effect dictating that any new sources of oil found would ONLY then be used for domestic consumption - and as such, curtailing the oil company from maximizing their profit on the open international market and thus calling into serious question your supposed "Free Market" Republican bonafides?


Nope, supply and demand would prevail

Allegedly? As mentioned in another thread, only one republican voted against drilling in ANWR. Do the math. It is elementary.

Also as mentioned, for sound energy independence, I support the extraction of all available petroleum and all coal while at the same advancing new energy technologies and efficiencies.


Since you allege earlier in this thread, that supply and demand issues only amount to 20% of the pressure on current prices, then it seems you are suggesting this would then justify a partial nationalization of the oil industry in order to stabilize domestic energy markets.

And if so ... then you're seriously starting to sound like Ted Kennedy on a crack bender and frankly, it's scaring me a little.
1) I do not support nationalizing and you have provided no rationale for the same.
2) The percentages mentioned are in respect to the ramp in price. Changes in the market would be very variable if any catalyst is allowed to take effect.


Take your time if you want, but I'll remind you ... I've noticed that often, when faced with a measured, sensible response to one of your typical rants, instead of taking the opportunity to engage in an actual discussion, you've instead just flat out ignored the post and gone after the low-hanging fruit of liberal-bashing. I'll say no more.Yawn... See above.

[Shotdsherrif]

All right then, fair enough. And I'll say right now, I know very little about domestic oil exploration so I'm honestly asking for a little education here. ...

So ... given the current state of gas prices, what exactly is stopping voters from beating a path to their legislator's door to demand a reassessment of oil exploration policy?

In coastal states I understand that offshore drilling is largely held back by waterfront property owners. But let's say here in Colorado ... which until just recently has been a dependable red state ... what's the hold-up? Newt says there's more oil up there in the Rockies than in Saudi Arabia. So ... I'm asking ... respectfully.

IF an argument were to be made to a moderately oriented voter who might otherwise be supporting a Democratic candidate, how would that argument go ...?

[pjc]

All right then, fair enough. And I'll say right now, I know very little about domestic oil exploration so I'm honestly asking for a little education here. ...

So ... given the current state of gas prices, what exactly is stopping voters from beating a path to their legislator's door to demand a reassessment of oil exploration policy?


It's in progress. Many petitions be signed, many email, telephone calls and fax's to the Congress creeps.

The pressure is most definitely "on".


In coastal states I understand that offshore drilling is largely held back by waterfront property owners. But let's say here in Colorado ... which until just recently has been a dependable red state ... what's the hold-up? Newt says there's more oil up there in the Rockies than in Saudi Arabia. So ... I'm asking ... respectfully.

IF an argument were to be made to a moderately oriented voter who might otherwise be supporting a Democratic candidate, how would that argument go ...?

For Oil shale the hold up is mostly red tape. Volumes of EIS work. At every step, there is obstructionism via federal laws mostly as a product of the lobbying of the eco-gestapo.

If B. Hussein is elected and the economy does not recover, the rats will most definitely be swept out in 2010 and thoroughly in 2012. The sentiment is building.

[Shotdsherrif]

Ok then, let me ask you this. You do acknowledge that it was GHW Bush that signed the last executive moratorium on exploration, right? So when W Bush asks congress last week to lift their own congressional moratorium, Pelosi casually brushes him off saying he should drop his first. I mean if this was a "real" issue wouldn't it serve the administration, in good faith, to get the ball rolling? And wouldn't congress, fearing a genuine and justified popular uprising, not be so cavalier about it? Why the dilly-dallying from both sides?

But yet this was the last I heard of it. Pelosi even added for good measure that there are still areas approved for exploration which oil companies have not moved forward on. What would be up with that?

See, the pieces just aren't fitting together for me. If you were to make the case that opening up ANWR or any other other potential options would unequivocally resolve our current crisis, even with a few years lagtime, I'd be behind it in a second. But I'm not hearing that case. Even from the administration ... even with McCain appearing to be on the ropes, they don't seem to be going after that fight. Why IS that?

Even you ... only mentioned 2010 or 2012 as a target date for this issue to come alive. And you even hedged on the economy ... though you say you have all these petitions and letters at the ready ... what's holding you back? Shouldn't you be ready to overcome any objections? People are hurting right now!! The time is ripe.

So what's the story? You make your case and I'm on your side.

[Ryno]

Adnoc is the state-owned company of the United Arab Emigrates
CNOOC is a 71% state-owned company of China
INOC is the state-owned company of Iraq
KPC is the state-owned company of Kuwait
Libya NOC is the state-owned company of Libya
NIOC is the state-owned company of Iran
NNPC is the state-owned company of Nigeria
ONGC is the 71.4% state-owned company of India
PDVSA is the state-owned company of Venezuela
Pemex is the state-owned company of Mexico
Pertamina is the state-owned company of Indonesia
PetroChina is the 90% state-owned company of China
Petronas is the state-owned company of Malaysia
QP is the state-owned company of Qatar
Rosneft is the 75.16% state-owned company of Russia
Saudi Aramco is the state-owned company of Saudi Arabia
Sonatrach is the state-owned company of Algeria
Statoil is the 70.9% state oil company of Norway


Hmmm... see any of the largest producers on the list???? How about the guys with the largest reserves???


Wow. That's quite a list. Pat...I hope you either have a small foot, or a big mouth. As well, I hope you haven't stepped in dog ***** lately.

I'm all for opinions on politics....but when 1/2 of the posts in this section are started by you...it gets old, and loses it's luster.

[pjc]

Wow. That's quite a list. Pat...I hope you either have a small foot, or a big mouth. As well, I hope you haven't stepped in dog ***** lately.


Excuse me but, I still see no viable presentation to nationalize US oil companies.


I'm all for opinions on politics....but when 1/2 of the posts in this section are started by you...it gets old, and loses it's luster.

Then don't read them.

[TreyP]

Then don't read them.

That's the most logical thing you have ever said.

[Shotdsherrif]

The silence is deafening ...

[randy s]

The silence is deafening ...

maybe because it was 3 in the morning.lol.

[pjc]

Mornin!

Did Trey say somethin? Lemme check...

....Nope.


Trey, I do look forward to the day when you actually engage in debate.

[Ziggy]

maybe because it was 3 in the morning.lol.

LMAO.

[R_TAYLOR]

Mornin!

Did Trey say somethin? Lemme check...

....Nope.


Trey, I do look forward to the day when you actually engage in debate.

You may be waiting awhile.

[Shotdsherrif]

maybe because it was 3 in the morning.lol.

:D ... Hey it was 12 hours since my last post. Plenty of time to respond.

Trey, I do look forward to the day when you actually engage in debate.

And Pat, So do I ...

[pjc]

:D ... Hey it was 12 hours since my last post. Plenty of time to respond.

Trey, I do look forward to the day when you actually engage in debate.

And Pat, So do I ...

I did respond, I think.. Maybe, I got the question wrong or maybe I disagree with the pretense of the question overall.

I'm confused.

http://www.baja.net/nobama/osamaobama.jpg

[Shotdsherrif]

What I'm saying Pat is that I think there is more to the story ... and the administration's feeble attempt (so far) to address this would appear to back me up.

And I'm also suggesting that if you're genuinely interested in promoting a soundER energy policy, then blanket, knee-jerk demonization of Democrats is not the way to go. So as usualy really, I'm just questioning your judgment and tactics.

[pjc]

What I'm saying Pat is that I think there is more to the story ... and the administration's feeble attempt (so far) to address this would appear to back me up.


Did you see my post on Lyndsey Williams?


then blanket, knee-jerk demonization of Democrats is not the way to go.


Ya but, it's a lot of fun.


So as usualy really, I'm just questioning your judgment and tactics.

See above.